Can a Solid Roller Cam Be Driven on Rhe Street

Cooter Sometime Timer Offline Posts: 8,028 "Then What? Then Let'south Trip the light fantastic"

Hadda friend over to the store the other night and he expressed his ideas regarding roller cams and the lack of need to run the "good" oil every bit they are rollers. I expressed my concern stating the roller lifters are coming apart at the axle/roller under STREET driving due to high spring rates on the solid cams. Then the "Expert" oil seems to notwithstanding exist a need even with roller cams. My question is, Tin can one theoretically run say a .680 Lift Solid roller cam with the "adept" oil on the street and it alive by the start 10K miles? I know with the v.0 liter croud, all nosotros had to practise was basically upgrade the cam and nosotros ran the stock lifters with hydraulic rollers for well over 100K miles. With the toll of solid/hydraulic roller components, it would stand to reason they would last, but this hasn't been my experience reading about all these badass cars on the Power Bout "eating" lifters after simply 500 Miles on the street. Sure, it'll run in the 9's 1/four mile, just won't go 500 miles without eating a lifter. Another buddy just finished up his 650 HP LS motor in his Vette, and the caput man. out in Cali. told him he'd be fine with the stock roller rockers. I Lifter and one rocker ground upward. He was running the skillful oil as well. "only" a .675 Lift Solid roller cam installed. Made it 800 miles on a brand new engine. So what say you?

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johnnyseville Full Member Offline Posts: 278

Not very likely, in fact highly unlikely.  Regardless of what lubricant y'all use, due to the high bound pressures, these set ups rarely terminal more three-4000 miles.  The roller lifter, specifically  the tiny needle bearings supporting the rollers give upwards, filling the engine with this debris and resultant failures. Great for power, and the IN thing to exercise for a super Hot engine, just no way around it. BTW.. I used to run a 700 plus lift roller in my Hemi, never put much miles on it, and then never had a trouble.

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BY RSCO Inferior Member Offline Posts: 145

I take been back and forth on this i also. I really think when y'all go into that much elevator, you lot for sure increase stress on lifters, springs, etc. There is merely no way around it. This is the point where the old saying comes in "if you want a race auto, so build a race car" - granted, there are some very fast street cars out there, just it does not come without a price.. I am going to be giving upwardly somewhere in the neighborhood or fifty-60hp (and using that number very conservatively....) on my 493 that is underway right at present, simply it is all for the sake of added reliability of not going crazy with the camshaft. The "good" oil will also still exist ran in it - in the m scheme of things it is cheap insurance.  Those are my worth, which are probably worth less than a penny in the existent world..

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bobs66440 Old Timer Offline Posts: 1,563 New York	My buddy has a radical loftier dollar 520" street roller motor with a high lift solid cam and all Harland Sharp stuff. He has almost 3000 miles on it and the builder told him he needs to send out all the lifters for inspection now (regardless of oil used). Style too much hassle for a street car for me...
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green69rt Old Timer Offline Posts: 3,622 Current status	I've been thinking about my engine build and this thread brings up some questions in my mind.  And so a roller hydraulic cam would be good for a street engine that will exist driven 2-3000 miles a yr and take good reliabilty (amend than a regular hydraulic cam???)   Or would I just exist wasting money on the roller setup??   Mild 440 with headers.
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Cooter Old Timer Offline Posts: 8,028 "So What? So Let's DANCE"	I'one thousand thinking it has more to exercise with how much Lift the roller cam has as to how difficult it is on Valve train components. I think a Balmy roller might live.
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bobs66440 Quondam Timer Offline Posts: 1,563 New York

I'm thinking it has more to do with how much LIFT the roller cam has as to how difficult information technology is on Valve railroad train components. I think a Mild roller might live. I agree. They accept been using hydraulic rollers successfully in Mustangs and other cars for decades. Hydraulic, that is. A mild solid will live too with regular adjustment, just if y'all're going balmy, then you wouldn't want a solid cam anyhow...

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oldschool Senior Member Offline Posts: 588

It all depends on the jump pressure.  With the solid roller cams y'all need to run much college leap pressures.  If you lot run a very mild solid roller you might be able to get away with less spring force per unit area but it will still be a lot more than a hyraulic cam.  The spring pressure is what tears up the lifters and wears out the rocker artillery. I use solid rollers in all my street driven cars, I just replace valve springs and lifters every couple thousand miles.  On my 580" motor that I drive on the street, information technology has 270 lbs on the seat and 850 lbs on the nose.  I just had some comp roller bearing lifters fail on this motor.  On the communication of firewoman Ron I switched to some Isky solid bushing roller lifters.  They claim these lifters have 350% more load carrying capacity.  These should be perfect for high spring pressures, they are also rebuildable.  I haven't run it much because of winter, but the idea of not having tool steel roller bearings flowing through my motor is reason plenty for me to become to the bushed lifters. I hope this helps.

Logged 1968 cuda formula S bb 4-sp                          1968 Charger R/T 500" 4-sp 1970 Charger 580" 4-sp 1970 Cuda Convertible 500" 4-sp 1970 Cuda Convertible 500" 4-sp Also MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS ALMOST Plenty!

Mytur Binsdirti Old Timer Offline Posts: five,860 Nosotros all put the yeast in.	It's also quite a off-white corporeality of dough to shell out. Is the actress dollars worth the few exta horsepower?
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johnnyseville Full Member Offline Posts: 278	It's also quite a off-white amount of dough to crush out. Is the extra dollars worth the few exta horsepower? When you get to a certain point in an all out engine rebuild, that extra few hundreds tin make a difference, so aye, nether those conditions it does pay.  For street, NO.
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oldschool Senior Fellow member Offline Posts: 588	It'southward too quite a fair amount of dough to shell out. Is the extra dollars worth the few exta horsepower? they are alot cheaper than an engine rebuild. tool steel will wreck a motor. in the right motor, a roller cam is is alot more than " a few horsepower".........
	Logged 1968 cuda formula South bb 4-sp                          1968 Charger R/T 500" iv-sp 1970 Charger 580" four-sp 1970 Cuda Convertible 500" 4-sp 1970 Cuda Convertible 500" iv-sp Too MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS ALMOST ENOUGH!

oldschool Senior Member Offline Posts: 588

It's also quite a fair corporeality of dough to vanquish out. Is the extra dollars worth the few exta horsepower? When yous go to a sure signal in an all out engine rebuild, that extra few hundreds can make a difference, so aye, under those weather condition it does pay.  For street, NO. you lot dont need an " all out" engine build to take reward of a roller cam. nigh new cars take them now..... a roller will nearly always make more power than a hydraulic or solid, at the aforementioned specs.

Logged 1968 cuda formula South bb 4-sp                          1968 Charger R/T 500" 4-sp 1970 Charger 580" 4-sp 1970 Cuda Convertible 500" 4-sp 1970 Cuda Convertible 500" 4-sp TOO MUCH HORSEPOWER, IS Nearly ENOUGH!

Cooter Quondam Timer Offline Posts: viii,028 "So What? Then Let'southward Trip the light fantastic"

you lot dont need an " all out" engine build to take advantage of a roller cam. most new cars have them now..... a roller volition almost always make more ability than a hydraulic or solid, at the same specs. Run across, that'south what I'thousand referring to. I've been taking advantage of roller cams in 5.0 Mustangs for years and figured I could practise the same with the BB Chrysler. Nevertheless, it would seem that BB Mopar guys are left with SOL when it comes to say a .600 Lift Roller on the street and Non have to tear information technology down every ten minutes. I've run equally much as .530 Lift in my own mustangs, and seen as much equally .600 Lift run on the street for years with no problems. Granted, they were all Hydraulic rollers, but still. I just need to figure out how I can seem to Take reward with my 440.

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firefighter3931 Global Moderator Old Timer Offline Posts: xi,498 572 street/strip bullet

I have a .680 solid roller in the 572 with moderate lobes requiring 250/600 jump pressures. Superlative shelf valvesprings/retainers, Harland Sharp roller rockers and the best lifters made (Isky EZ-Curlicue) with the solid bushing as opposed to needle bearings. The central is using quality parts, especially on a street/strip build that will see extended idle time in traffic, cruising etc... Hydraulic rollers work OK but are rpm limited due to the inherent design of the hyd lifter accompanied by a heavy valvetrain. About hyd rollers go erratic/unstable at 5500 rpm so if your build is configured to brand power beyond that threshold a hyd roller is not your all-time selection. Ron

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johnnyseville Full Member Offline Posts: 278

Very squeamish lifter!  Pricey, but worth it when you have so much money in your engine.  I am certain will extend life past the conventional needles, though how much, non sure.  Anytime there is a moving part they are subject area to failure.  Solids are king as far as dependability.  Though I practice non see much of them used anymore, the mushroom tappets were a step upwards from the conventional solids, downside was the machining involved.   Still used in oval tracks where rollers are not allowed.

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firefighter3931 Global Moderator Old Timer Offline Posts: 11,498 572 street/strip bullet

Johnny, the EZ-gyre lifters are expensive, no doubt....simply worth every penny in my opinion. A buddy has them in his 800hp pump gas Hemi with several thousand miles and hundreds of passes. He has sent them back to Isky twice while freshening the motor and both times they were returned intact and he was told :  "skillful to get" With the lower spring pressures of street roller these lifters are virtually bulletproof. Others run them with 1000lbs over the olfactory organ without problems and thousands of passes. Proper valvespring inspection and maintenance is key ; in one case the springs commencement to go away the lifters will bounce and stuff starts to pause. The more agressive the cam profile....the more than inspection/maintenance/parts replacement required, no mode around it. Ron

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buzz Total Member Offline Posts: 344	and so I merely got a cam reccommendation from comp for a 493", fuel injected engine w/5 speed manuel trans, looking for 550-600 hp, interstate capable. Asked for a roller lifter. It is a comp retro fit xr286hr-ten. Good Choice or not
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johnnyseville Full Member Offline Posts: 278

Johnny, the EZ-coil lifters are expensive, no doubtfulness....but worth every penny in my stance. A buddy has them in his 800hp pump gas Hemi with several thousand miles and hundreds of passes. He has sent them dorsum to Isky twice while freshening the motor and both times they were returned intact and he was told :  "skillful to go" With the lower spring pressures of street roller these lifters are most bulletproof. Others run them with 1000lbs over the nose without problems and thousands of passes. Proper valvespring inspection and maintenance is key ; one time the springs get-go to become away the lifters will bounce and stuff starts to break. The more agressive the cam profile....the more than inspection/maintenance/parts replacement required, no style around it. Ron Glad you pointed these lifters out.  I am trying to work out a deal on a real wild stroked Hemi, large roller, but doubt he has these lifters, basically a Comp Cam package.   If I exercise, this volition exist the first thing I update with, since information technology will be basically a street freak and need reliability.  Driving stock is really ho-hum. Thanks for the info.

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firefighter3931 Global Moderator Former Timer Offline Posts: 11,498 572 street/strip bullet

Glad you pointed these lifters out.  I am trying to work out a deal on a real wild stroked Hemi, big roller, but dubiety he has these lifters, basically a Comp Cam package.   If I do, this will be the start thing I update with, since it will be basically a street freak and demand reliability.  Driving stock is actually wearisome. Thanks for the info. No trouble Johnny, the Isky's can take a lickin' and won't start tickin ! The Comp 829's are OK for limited apply (elevate race) or slow lobed street rollers with mild(er) leap pressures. Even at that, they should exist inspected/re-built every one-2 years. Comp needs to stride up their roller lifter program, inmo. Brian (OldSchool) was eating lifters in his 580 Wedge and using a stiff spring to command the valve action with 1.7 rockers and .800 valve lift ; the EZ-Gyre'south were a articulate winner when it came time to replace those parts. I'one thousand very confident his lifter issues are a thing of the by. Good luck on your build....i look frontwards to the results ! Ron

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firefighter3931 Global Moderator Erstwhile Timer Offline Posts: eleven,498 572 street/strip bullet

so I just got a cam reccommendation from comp for a 493", fuel injected engine w/5 speed manuel trans, looking for 550-600 hp, interstate capable. Asked for a roller lifter. Information technology is a comp retro fit xr286hr-ten. Good Choice or not That's a hyd roller cam....good to 5500rpm redline. Depending on the cylinder head selection it could be a expert fit to achieve your power goals and exist reliable. Ron

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Challenger340 Old Timer Offline Posts: iii,318 Better to be a "has been", than a "never was"

Good Thread.... I call back the best thing to remember here...is to distinguish between HYDRAULIC Rollers, STREET Mechanical Rollers, and RACE Mechanical Rollers.... and, the limitations/demands placed upon the Lifters past the Bound Rates and Pressures each of the higher up types of Cam profiles requires. Wanna really take fun.....then offset discussing spring slew rates for each of the above @ rpm as a factor to subversive harmonics to control in the street driven environment. IMO, Leave the "Race" Roller Profiles at the runway....lest ya wearable yer parts on the street.

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Cooter Onetime Timer Offline Posts: eight,028 "So What? And then Let's Trip the light fantastic toe"

VERY skillful info gentlemen! Sounds like for my set up, I judge if you lot want HUGE power and not accept to tear into the engine every year to supercede worn out lifters, it'll accept some sort of Forced induction on a mild build. That style, You lot aren't trying to take a 700 HP race engine ("All motor") and bulldoze it on the street. Kinda similar Stall Converters were about x years ago. A 4500 Converter on the street couldn't be done. I tried.. Today, it would seem that'south the "norm".

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fizz Total Member Offline Posts: 344	Ron, from by post we were thinking Indy EZ. Hither I am hijacking once more
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buzz Full Fellow member Offline Posts: 344	Do yous call up I should go the whole valve railroad train, ie lifters, rockers, and shafts from comp, or is there a better choice
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firefighter3931 Global Moderator Old Timer Offline Posts: 11,498 572 street/strip bullet

Ron, from by post we were thinking Indy EZ. Here I am hijacking again Ok, now i remember....post from awhile back. Sure the EZ head is fine or even the Edelbrock RPM could meet those power goals ! Do you recall I should get the whole valve train, ie lifters, rockers, and shafts from comp, or is there a amend choice There are a lot of choices and the Comp Pro-Magnum rockers are very dainty and compatible with Hyd Roller spring pressures. Problems arise when spring loads exceed the blueprint limit of the rocker arm. With heavy leap loads yous really demand a fully rollerized rocker organization. I would have no problem using the XR286HR with the matching springs/lifters Ron

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